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PICList Thread
'Start programming for the Scenix!'
1998\01\13@194019 by Eric Smith

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Would you like to start programming the new Scenix microcontroller?  You
can with Loren Blaney's SxSim, a screen-oriented simulator that's easy
to use.

       http://www.brouhaha.com/~eric/pic/sxsim/

Features:   Also simulates PIC 16C5x
           Step backwards
           Stimulus files
           Checkpoints
           Watchdog timer
           Mouse controls
           Profiler
           ASCII I/O instructions
           Similar to Parallax's PSIM
           Runs under DOS
           Works with SPASM and MPASM
           Source code included
           Absolutely free

Note that I am posting this for Loren.  Please don't email me with questions
about SxSim.

1998\01\13@202736 by Andrew Mayo

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Actually I'd like to *buy* some of the damned things. Are they actually,
really, truly orderable, deliverable in a finite time-frame etc. and if
so from whom (in qty 20, say). Or is it still 'real soon now'?

{Quote hidden}

1998\01\13@211307 by jhobbs

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>> Features:   Also simulates PIC 16C5x
>>             Step backwards
>>             Stimulus files
>>             Checkpoints
>>             Watchdog timer
>>             Mouse controls
>>             Profiler
>>             ASCII I/O instructions
>>             Similar to Parallax's PSIM
>>             Runs under DOS
>>             Works with SPASM and MPASM
>>             Source code included
>>             Absolutely free



Is Running under dos really a feature? :)

Besides who wants to design with a chip that may be dead before it ever
ships.  The designers of the chip chip (parallax) is looking at $500,000 in
legal fees, and the contracted manufacture Scenix may end up with there own
set of problems ($$$) from this fiasco before it is all over.  Hell, they
may just be a typical ruthless company and burn whatever is left of parallax
to just save them selves, and why not?

Any how, just now I decided to call scenix about the sx parts, well they
tell me parts are in but I can not buy them from them, that I must go
through parallax.  I ask two more times just to make sure that we are
talking about the sx parts and that they are really in. OK time to call
parallax.

I have called parallax, they tell me they have nothing to sell, no sxkey and
no parts.  Hmm  I tell them that scenix is telling people the parts are in
and you are selling them.  Well they go check, and a few minutes later they
tell me they have no parts and they are not sure of when they will get them
other then soon.  I ask, how soon is soon? I get some hemming and hawing and
they say not sure!  OK, I let it drop.

Does this sound familiar?

P.S.  flames on -  but think about this, if you are doing real design work
for any sizeable or smart company, there is no way in hell anyone would give
approval to design in the sx part.

Take care  -Jim

1998\01\13@215038 by Andrew Mayo

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I agree. The litigation issues look very scary and Microchip have deep
pockets. But the thing that makes me the most suspicious is the huge
leap forward in performance this thing is supposed to have. I can't
believe Mchip wouldn't sell a 50MHz EEPROM-based processor if they
thought they could make them with acceptable yields. I assume Scenix are
contracting fab resources from some other third party, anyway. If the
design is so nice, why not have Mchip make the darn thing and pay
royalties. Why make it yourself. At the supposed price of a couple of
bucks each, how many do you need to sell to amortise the development and
startup costs. No, this is looking increasingly like a scam, possibly
one that Parallax themselves fell for. Did they *really* design the chip
- if so, why have an unknown company like Scenix sell it - why not sell
it yourself?.

In any case, even if this device had a brand-new instruction set, it
would *still* sell. Who cares if the code has to be written from scratch
- this kind of performance would easily justify this for the kind of
device you'd be building. After all, every DSP has a different
instruction set. A new architecture could still be very similar to the
PIC's i.e use a Harvard architecture, multiple registers etc. but
different instructions. Presto, no risk of litigation. If you're working
in C, would you even care? (and a new C compiler could be produced for
peanuts). I mean, this isn't like a PC, where software compatibility is
essential. You're up for a new emulator etc. anyway, for this chip. It
has unique features etc, so you're *still* writing software specially
for it, anyway.

If the lit. costs were 500K this is small change to purchase a nice
design so why aren't any of the other semiconductor vendors sniffing
around. Let's just go to http://www.scenix.com, shall we.....

hmm, its been slightly revamped but...
QUOTE
Volume availability of the SX devices will be available through Scenix
and select distributors in late Q4, 1997.
UNQUOTE

nope, no-one's updated any of the information on it. Anyone who still
thinks this isn't some kind of scam, let me know. I have a great option
on the Brooklyn Bridge......

{Quote hidden}

1998\01\13@222415 by Ken Pergola

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Andrew Mayo wrote:

> Anyone who still thinks this isn't some kind of scam, let me know.



Andrew,

With all due respect, I've never felt that Scenix had a scam on their hands.

Isn't the main purpose of a scam to make money? What does Scenix really have
to gain if this is a just a scam?

Small and seemingly unknown companies can come up with great designs too. It
happens all the time. It just seems to be an unfortunate situation for all
parties at this time. Although I'm a great fan of PICs, I can only see good
things come from competition in this industry.

Ken Pergola

1998\01\13@230337 by Andrew Mayo

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I want very much for this product to exist. And I want very much to
believe it genuinely does. Calling it a scam is probably unfair - I
suspect what has happened here is that Parallax and Scenix have
overreached themselves and underestimated the costs of producing these
chips, but any which way, I doubt we'll see them soon. The truth is out
there....... somewhere

{Quote hidden}

1998\01\14@002126 by tjaart

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jhobbs wrote:
>
> >> Features:   Also simulates PIC 16C5x
> >>             Step backwards
> >>             Stimulus files
> >>             Checkpoints
> >>             Watchdog timer
> >>             Mouse controls
> >>             Profiler
> >>             ASCII I/O instructions
> >>             Similar to Parallax's PSIM
> >>             Runs under DOS
> >>             Works with SPASM and MPASM
> >>             Source code included
> >>             Absolutely free
>
> Is Running under dos really a feature? :)

If some other guy wrote it and is giving it to you for free without
making
*any* money out of it, I'd say running under EDLIN would be a feature.
Hell, running it on an abacus would be just fine.

>
> Besides who wants to design with a chip that may be dead before it ever
> ships.  The designers of the chip chip (parallax) is looking at $500,000 in
> legal fees, and the contracted manufacture Scenix may end up with there own
> set of problems ($$$) from this fiasco before it is all over.  Hell, they
> may just be a typical ruthless company and burn whatever is left of parallax
> to just save them selves, and why not?

May yes, may not.

{Quote hidden}

They SX key has a SX part in it, right?
Parallax are flogging the SX keys, right?

It makes sense to use the first batch of SX parts to make up as many SX
keys
as possible so people won't kill each other over a development tool.

>
> P.S.  flames on -  but think about this, if you are doing real design work
> for any sizeable or smart company, there is no way in hell anyone would give
> approval to design in the sx part.
Of course not. I'd would be naive to think there won't be any hiccups.
I wouldn't mind laying my dirty little hands on one of these parts
though...

>
> Take care  -Jim

--
Friendly Regards

Tjaart van der Walt
@spam@tjaartKILLspamspamwasp.co.za
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1998\01\14@044822 by Steve Baldwin

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> QUOTE
> Volume availability of the SX devices will be available through Scenix
> and select distributors in late Q4, 1997.
> UNQUOTE

If they have published Q4, 1997 then they still have another 12 months to
go if they are keeping with this industry's norm for shipping dates.

> nope, no-one's updated any of the information on it. Anyone who still
> thinks this isn't some kind of scam, let me know. I have a great option
> on the Brooklyn Bridge......

The data on the web page was updated on the 9th of Jan.
Tell me more about your bridge deal. :-)

Steve.

======================================================
 Very funny Scotty.  Now beam down my clothes.
======================================================
Steve Baldwin                Electronic Product Design
TLA Microsystems Ltd         Microcontroller Specialists
PO Box 15-680                email: KILLspamstevebKILLspamspamkcbbs.gen.nz
New Lynn, Auckland           ph  +64 9 820-2221
New Zealand                  fax +64 9 820-1929
======================================================

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