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PICList Thread
'[PIC] extracting firmware from Pic 16C54'
2006\04\27@174302 by Marcel Birthelmer

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Hi,
I have a PCI board that has a 16C54 on it. Is it possible to extract the
firmware from this chip? (It's PLCC so I can get to it) If so, how?
Thanks,
- Marcel

2006\04\28@022626 by Peter

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Marcel Birthelmer <marcelb.lists <at> gmail.com> writes:

> Hi,
> I have a PCI board that has a 16C54 on it. Is it possible to extract the
> firmware from this chip? (It's PLCC so I can get to it) If so, how?

This must be a really bad joke I don't get.

Peter


2006\04\28@034437 by Ravi Pailoor

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face
>>I have a PCI board that has a 16C54 on it. Is it possible to extract the
>>firmware from this chip? (It's PLCC so I can get to it) If so, how?

IMHO, 16C54 does not come in PLCC package. If it is 16C554, then it must
be a 4 port UART chip from Philips.

--
Cheers

Ravi

2006\04\28@041222 by Bob Axtell

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Peter wrote:
> Marcel Birthelmer <marcelb.lists <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
>  
>> Hi,
>> I have a PCI board that has a 16C54 on it. Is it possible to extract the
>> firmware from this chip? (It's PLCC so I can get to it) If so, how?
>>    
>
> This must be a really bad joke I don't get.
>
> Peter
>
>
>  
The original PIC16C54 required parallel programming. He needs a special
tool to be able to read it.
I don't have one any longer, but I DID have one.

--Bob

2006\04\28@043433 by Bob Axtell

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Bob Axtell wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Oops, PLCC? I don't remember a PLCC PIC in those days...

??

--Bob

2006\04\28@090346 by M. Adam Davis

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Aside from the comments that such a chip doesn't exist (ie, 16c54 does
not come in a PLCC package) you can read a non-code-protected 16C54
using a parallel programmer, such as the PICStart Plus.

If it's code protected you won't have any luck.

-Adam

On 4/27/06, Marcel Birthelmer <spam_OUTmarcelb.listsTakeThisOuTspamgmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
> I have a PCI board that has a 16C54 on it. Is it possible to extract the
> firmware from this chip? (It's PLCC so I can get to it) If so, how?
> Thanks,
> - Marcel
> -

2006\04\28@102708 by Mark Jordan

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face

       I remember reading some page about decoding the extracted data
from the old 16C54 due to the weak protection scheme used.

       MJ

On 28 Apr 2006 at 9:03, M. Adam Davis wrote:

{Quote hidden}

2006\04\28@135337 by Robert Rolf

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Mark Jordan wrote:

>        I remember reading some page about decoding the extracted data
> from the old 16C54 due to the weak protection scheme used.

Almost correct.

You cycle through all possible values for a program location,
and ask the device to 'verify'. It will report 'failed' for
all values except the one that is programmed. So the one value
that verified is your data.

Talk about an easy crack...

Robert

2006\04\28@140436 by Marcel Birthelmer

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No I'm pretty sure it's a 16C54. I can peel off the sticker again tonight,
but I'm somewhat certain. And it sits in a little PLCC-style adapter on the
card.
The card is a SunPCI II card, basically a complete x86 computer on a PCI
card designed for Sparc machines to be able to run dos/windows at decent
speeds.
- Marcel

On 4/28/06, Mark Jordan <enkispamKILLspamcpovo.net> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>

2006\04\28@144724 by Marcel Birthelmer

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OK, my mistake. 16C64. They look almost the same. So, the original question,
but now in context of a 16C64: How do I get the code off of it?
- Marcel

On 4/28/06, Marcel Birthelmer <EraseMEmarcelb.listsspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTgmail.com> wrote:
>
> No I'm pretty sure it's a 16C54. I can peel off the sticker again tonight,
> but I'm somewhat certain. And it sits in a little PLCC-style adapter on the
> card.
> The card is a SunPCI II card, basically a complete x86 computer on a PCI
> card designed for Sparc machines to be able to run dos/windows at decent
> speeds.
> - Marcel
>
>

2006\04\28@144846 by Charles Craft

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us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/mxsun_1893_5951925

Don't see anything like a socketed PIC on the diagram above.

{Original Message removed}

2006\04\28@145655 by M. Adam Davis

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Same answer.  Use a PIC programmer that will read/program this type of
PIC.  I suggest the PICStart plus, but there are others.  You can
check out the programming specification on microchip's website if you
want to try and build a circuit to do it for you.

-Adam

On 4/28/06, Marcel Birthelmer <marcelb.listsspamspam_OUTgmail.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\04\28@150134 by Marcel Birthelmer

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I believe it's the chip labelled BIOS.
Curiously, my board has a sound chip near the bottom right of that image
that's not shown there. Maybe a special revision or something.
I can take pictures of the board tonight.
- Marcel

On 4/28/06, Charles Craft <KILLspamchuckseaKILLspamspammindspring.com> wrote:
>
> http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/mxsun_1893_5951925
>
> Don't see anything like a socketed PIC on the diagram above.
>
> {Original Message removed}

2006\04\28@151422 by M. Adam Davis

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It is most likely that the chip is a flash memory device, not a
processor or microcontroller.  If so, you'll need to build or buy a
parallel flash reader.  Alternately, boot the board and read the flash
chip with a program designed to read it.

Make sure to note all the chip markings, especially the logo.  If it
doesn't have the microchip M, then it's not a PIC.

-Adam

On 4/28/06, Marcel Birthelmer <RemoveMEmarcelb.listsTakeThisOuTspamgmail.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> > {Original Message removed}

2006\04\28@152017 by Marcel Birthelmer

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www.sun.com/desktop/products/*sunpci*/*sunpci*iipro_wp010520.pdf

On page 22 of that PDF (page 18 of the document) there's a diagram which
shows a "Microcontroller" between the PCI bridge and the input devices. I
believe that this is the role filled by the Pic.

- Marcel


On 4/28/06, Charles Craft <TakeThisOuTchuckseaEraseMEspamspam_OUTmindspring.com> wrote:
>
> http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/mxsun_1893_5951925
>
> Don't see anything like a socketed PIC on the diagram above.
>

2006\04\28@152519 by Marcel Birthelmer

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Well, it says Microchip PIC16C64A on the chip (with the logo).
Why do you think it ought to be a flash device?

On 4/28/06, M. Adam Davis <RemoveMEstienmanspamTakeThisOuTgmail.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> > > {Original Message removed}

2006\04\28@160507 by Peter

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On Fri, 28 Apr 2006, Bob Axtell wrote:

> The original PIC16C54 required parallel programming. He needs a
> special tool to be able to read it. I don't have one any longer, but I
> DID have one.

Well I STILL have one, moreover I designed and built it myself years
ago, and wrote the driver too (and it still works). But that was not the
part I did not understand. The part I did not understand was, why he
asks for help to get at firmware that was locked away by someone on a
list full of people who do just that (lock away their firmware to
prevent unauthorized copying) for a living ...

Peter

2006\04\28@161943 by Marcel Birthelmer

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Because it's a piece of hardware that's barely supported and definitely not
on the platform I'd like to use it on. Moreover, I'm not trying to
illegitimately reproduce this board for profit or anything else sinister. I
just want to take a shot at getting this thing to do something.
- Marcel

On 4/28/06, Peter <RemoveMEplpEraseMEspamEraseMEactcom.co.il> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -


'[PIC] extracting firmware from Pic 16C54'
2006\05\01@150305 by alan smith
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I wouldnt think a PIC could keep up with PCI speeds really...wonder what it is doing.
 
 To answer why he thought it would be a flash....because bios chips are typically alway flash memory devices

               
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