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PICList Thread
'[OT] PIC vs. SX'
2006\07\21@122408 by Rob Weiss

picon face
Opinions? I am getting started on developing some hardware/software
applications, (I prefer to write in C++) and would like to know if there is
any pro/con to either chip. I have pointed more toward the SX chip as there
is compiler support for C++.

2006\07\21@124755 by John Chung

picon face
First of all, are you going to use a lot of MCU in
your projects? If so, is SX cheap enough for you? The
last time I checked SX wasn't cheap enough and hard to
get. If you don want to spend a dime on a C compiler
for PIC you can use free alternatives like SDCC and
Hitech compiler. Both of them works but the support is
limited  in terms of PIC chip supported. PIC C
compiler which are free pales in comparison to AVR.
AVR has a good GCC compiler in place. I use GCC for
AVR instead.  

John.

PS: If you are new to MCU I suggest you stick with
PIC. Assembly for PIC is not too hard and we HAVE a
very good forum. PICLIST!

--- Rob Weiss <spam_OUTj105.robTakeThisOuTspamgmail.com> wrote:

> Opinions? I am getting started on developing some
> hardware/software
> applications, (I prefer to write in C++) and would
> like to know if there is
> any pro/con to either chip. I have pointed more
> toward the SX chip as there
> is compiler support for C++.
> --

2006\07\21@131056 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> Opinions? I am getting started on developing some hardware/software
> applications, (I prefer to write in C++) and would like to
> know if there is
> any pro/con to either chip. I have pointed more toward the SX
> chip as there
> is compiler support for C++.

Which C++ compiler supports SX but not PIC?

Anyway, if you realy want C++ I'd take someting different, for instance
an ARM.

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\07\21@133752 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
Rob Weiss wrote:
> Opinions? I am getting started on developing some hardware/software
> applications, (I prefer to write in C++) and would like to know if there is
> any pro/con to either chip. I have pointed more toward the SX chip as there
> is compiler support for C++.
>  
I no longer believe that SX has enough speed advantage to bet a PIC,
especially a 48Mhz PIC18F. I
don't think their longeveity is very great, and they seem expensive (to
me). I would stay with PIC, no
question about it.

--Bob

2006\07\21@135606 by Robert Young

picon face


{Quote hidden}

Note, depending on which PIC you go for, V7.41 of MPLAB has the PCB C
compiler included from CCS.  Not the worst deal in the world (free)...

And I'll second John (and before Olin jumps in maybe).  Learn assembly
first.  It will be VERY helpful down the line reguardless of what you
end up using as a compiler.

Rob

2006\07\21@144002 by James Newtons Massmind

face picon face
> I no longer believe that SX has enough speed advantage to bet
> a PIC, especially a 48Mhz PIC18F. I don't think their
> longeveity is very great, and they seem expensive (to me). I
> would stay with PIC, no question about it.
>
> --Bob


A 48Mhz PIC is running at 12 million instructions per second. A 75Mhz SX is
running at just under 75 Million Instructions per second. That is more than
6 times faster. Just so you know; maybe that is not enough speed advantage,
and maybe it is.

---
James.


2006\07\21@150143 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
James Newtons Massmind wrote:
>> I no longer believe that SX has enough speed advantage to bet
>> a PIC, especially a 48Mhz PIC18F. I don't think their
>> longeveity is very great, and they seem expensive (to me). I
>> would stay with PIC, no question about it.
>>
>> --Bob
>>    
>
>
> A 48Mhz PIC is running at 12 million instructions per second. A 75Mhz SX is
> running at just under 75 Million Instructions per second. That is more than
> 6 times faster. Just so you know; maybe that is not enough speed advantage,
> and maybe it is.
>
> ---
> James.
>  
>
>  
The SX doesn't run 1/4 like the PIC?

2006\07\21@151250 by John Chung

picon face
Nope. What you see is what you get. dsPic is
instruction = clock.

John
--- Bob Axtell <.....engineerKILLspamspam.....cotse.net> wrote:

>
> >  
> >
> >  
> The SX doesn't run 1/4 like the PIC?
> --

2006\07\21@152737 by James Newtons Massmind

face picon face
> > A 48Mhz PIC is running at 12 million instructions per
> second. A 75Mhz
> > SX is running at just under 75 Million Instructions per
> second. That
> > is more than
> > 6 times faster. Just so you know; maybe that is not enough speed
> > advantage, and maybe it is.
> >
> > ---
> > James.
> >  
> >
> >  
> The SX doesn't run 1/4 like the PIC?

No sir. It pipelines so as it is executing 1 instruction it is loading
another, addressing a second and storing the result from a 4th. The pipeline
clears on jumps (no skips) so it isn't exactly full speed, but it gets
pretty close.

See
http://www.sxlist.com for more

---
James.


2006\07\21@152750 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> The SX doesn't run 1/4 like the PIC?

It will, if you ask it kindly (that is, you turn on its 'compatibility
mode'). But 'natively' it does not divide by 4. An SX is a 12-bit PIC on
steroids, running 1:1, interrupts, 8 level stack, and a few extra
instructions.

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\07\21@155715 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
Wouter van Ooijen wrote:
>> The SX doesn't run 1/4 like the PIC?
>>    
>
> It will, if you ask it kindly (that is, you turn on its 'compatibility
> mode'). But 'natively' it does not divide by 4. An SX is a 12-bit PIC on
> steroids, running 1:1, interrupts, 8 level stack, and a few extra
> instructions.
>
> Wouter van Ooijen
>
> -- -------------------------------------------
> Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
> consultancy, development, PICmicro products
> docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu
>  
>
>  
Thanks for enlightening me, folks. At 75Mhz I know an application.

--Bob

2006\07\21@160958 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
Does anyone know if it's true that they're a little "unreliable" at > 50Mhz?

-marc

On 7/21/06, Bob Axtell <EraseMEengineerspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTcotse.net> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\07\21@174738 by Denny Esterline

picon face
> Nope. What you see is what you get. dsPic is
> instruction = clock.
>
> John

Says who?

DSPic is 1/4, but it has a PLL so the clock can be 1-16 times the osc.

-Denny


2006\07\21@184224 by James Newtons Massmind

face picon face
> Does anyone know if it's true that they're a little
> "unreliable" at > 50Mhz?
>
> -marc

I've never hand a hiccup. As long as you are building a circuit around the
SX that can handle 75Mhz (and that can be a trick) then the SX will fly
along just fine.

Truth be told... And, no, you shouldn't try this at home... Or rather, you
should ONLY try this at home and never in a commercial product... But they
will manage 100Mhz nicely. I even have some old SX52's that are RATED at
100Mhz.

---
James Newton, Host of SXList.com
jamesspamspam_OUTsxlist.com 1-619-652-0593 fax:1-208-279-8767
SX FAQ / Code / Tutorials / Documentation:
http://www.sxlist.com Pick faster!


2006\07\21@191942 by Also-Antal Csaba

flavicon
face
Rob Weiss wrote:
> Opinions? I am getting started on developing some hardware/software
> applications, (I prefer to write in C++) and would like to know if there is
> any pro/con to either chip. I have pointed more toward the SX chip as there
> is compiler support for C++.

atmel avr/arm. i think the gpp will work with arm, but why u need c++?

udv
Csaba

2006\07\22@011240 by John Chung

picon face
Read through it to clarify my memory.Thanks Denny

John

--- Denny Esterline <@spam@firmwareKILLspamspamtds.net> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> --

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