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PICList Thread
'[EE] Video overlay chips'
2006\05\14@060918 by Robert Rolf

picon face
Bob Axtell wrote:

> While I am at it there are a couple of others you need to watch
> carefully: Atmel
> (drops product lines much too easily); and ST (drops SOME product lines-
> such as video overlay generators- even when they cornered the world market!
> go figure!).

On that topic, anyone found a replacement video overlay chip as
good at their discontinued STV5730?

Robert

2006\05\14@151834 by Peter

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On Sun, 14 May 2006, Robert Rolf wrote:

{Quote hidden}

If you mean PIP, Philips makes something I think.

Peter

'[EE] Video overlay chips (OSD text)'
2006\05\14@172420 by Robert Rolf

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Peter wrote:
>
> On Sun, 14 May 2006, Robert Rolf wrote:
>
>
>>Bob Axtell wrote:
>>
>>
>>>While I am at it there are a couple of others you need to watch carefully:
>>>Atmel
>>>(drops product lines much too easily); and ST (drops SOME product lines-
>>>such as video overlay generators- even when they cornered the world market!
>>>go figure!).
>>
>>On that topic, anyone found a replacement video overlay chip as
>>good at their discontinued STV5730?
>
>
> If you mean PIP, Philips makes something I think.

No, I am looking for OSD (on screen display of text).
Seems the only stuff in production is meant for RGB CRT & LCD screens.
Nothing out there to do composite video (monochrome).
BOB III is nice but I'd like to know what chip he's using.

Robert

2006\05\14@175945 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
Robert Rolf wrote:
> Bob Axtell wrote:
>
>  
>> While I am at it there are a couple of others you need to watch
>> carefully: Atmel
>> (drops product lines much too easily); and ST (drops SOME product lines-
>> such as video overlay generators- even when they cornered the world market!
>> go figure!).
>>    
>
> On that topic, anyone found a replacement video overlay chip as
> good at their discontinued STV5730?
>
> Robert
>
>  
That's exactly what I meant, Robert.

I (and others) designed the ST5730A into almost every police car in
north america, then
later ST discovered that that volumes were "NOT adequate". I begged, I
pleaded, I threw a fit. The
best that happened was that they made one more run and my clients bought
up about 10K for
advance designs. I even begged ST to double the cost, but nothing caused
them to release the masks
to a Korean clone maker nor to keep making it.

Since that time, I had to give up on ST. No vision over there
whatsoever. Well, whattayaexpect for
a company where everyone goes on vacation 12 weeks a year...

--Bob

2006\05\15@043925 by Alan B. Pearce

face picon face
>>>On that topic, anyone found a replacement video overlay chip as
>>>good at their discontinued STV5730?
>>
>>
>> If you mean PIP, Philips makes something I think.
>
>No, I am looking for OSD (on screen display of text).
>Seems the only stuff in production is meant for RGB CRT & LCD screens.
>Nothing out there to do composite video (monochrome).
>BOB III is nice but I'd like to know what chip he's using.

Program up a dsPic ? I would have though they would have sufficient internal
speed to do this.

2006\05\15@045302 by Jinx

face picon face
Dontronics has a couple of micro-to-video drivers, not
exactly turnkey OSD though

http://www.dontronics.com/micro-vga.html

http://www.dontronics.com/micro-lcd_mk2.html

I had a look a couple of years ago at branding video tapes
and worked out it would be possible with a Scenix, so I
guess a dsPIC would be up to it as well

2006\05\15@051313 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
Jinx wrote:
> Dontronics has a couple of micro-to-video drivers, not
> exactly turnkey OSD though
>
> http://www.dontronics.com/micro-vga.html
>
> http://www.dontronics.com/micro-lcd_mk2.html
>
> I had a look a couple of years ago at branding video tapes
> and worked out it would be possible with a Scenix, so I
> guess a dsPIC would be up to it as well
>
>  
I'm skeptical. These police textual overlays need to be very small in
size, smaller
than TV screen overlays. Must be able to get 26 characters x 14 lines on
a screen.
Take a look at "Wildest Police Video" and you'll see how small those
overlays are.
ALL of those overlays use the ST5730A or its 1985 predecessor (can't
remember
the number now, but it was ST also), which was the same text size.

The ST5730A will be sorely missed. The ST5730A could switch from blue screen
to red screen to white screen under software control, as well as
generate text.

The BOBIII uses a Mitsubishi chip which is NOT available through normal  
channels.

I can do it with a PIC, a RAM, a video synch chip, and a FPGA (timing
chain), but it
is very messy.  The answer is for one of the clone houses on Taiwan
(Brilliant Semi,
etc) to clone the ST5730A. Anybody have any better ideas?

--Bob

2006\05\15@053046 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 02:13 AM 5/15/2006 -0700, you wrote:

>I can do it with a PIC, a RAM, a video synch chip, and a FPGA (timing
>chain), but it
>is very messy.  The answer is for one of the clone houses on Taiwan
>(Brilliant Semi,
>etc) to clone the ST5730A. Anybody have any better ideas?
>
>--Bob

It might be an interesting open-source project to produce a synthesizable
core functionally compatible with one of the existing chips, as has been
done with the venerable 6845.

>Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
spam_OUTspeffTakeThisOuTspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
->>Test equipment, parts OLED displys http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2006\05\15@053313 by Jinx

face picon face
> The answer is for one of the clone houses on Taiwan (Brilliant Semi,
> etc) to clone the ST5730A. Anybody have any better ideas?

Rochester ? http://www.rocelec.com/

http://www.xs4all.nl/~ganswijk/chipdir/bro/r.htm

"Rochester Electronics, Inc. was founded in 1981 to support the growing
problem of semiconductor obsolescence. Over that time, Rochester has
become the factory authorized source for obsolescent semiconductors
from AMD, Allegro, Altera, Analog Devices, Cypress, Harris, Intel,
International Rectifier, Microchip, National, Quality, SMC, Texas
Instruments, Vantis and Xilinx. These alliances provide customers
with a reliable continuing source of supply for ongoing requirements"


2006\05\15@053415 by Dave Wheeler

flavicon
face
---------------------snip---------------------
> I can do it with a PIC, a RAM, a video synch chip, and a FPGA (timing
> chain), but it
> is very messy.  The answer is for one of the clone houses on Taiwan
> (Brilliant Semi,
> etc) to clone the ST5730A. Anybody have any better ideas?
>
> --Bob
>
>  
We use the Sanyo LC74782M in one of our products, there are some others
in the same family, don't know about availability though.

Cheers
Dave

2006\05\15@130531 by Robert Rolf

picon face
Dave Wheeler wrote:
> ---------------------snip---------------------
>
>>I can do it with a PIC, a RAM, a video synch chip, and a FPGA (timing
>>chain), but it
>>is very messy.  The answer is for one of the clone houses on Taiwan
>>(Brilliant Semi,
>>etc) to clone the ST5730A. Anybody have any better ideas?
>>
>>--Bob
>>
>>  
>
> We use the Sanyo LC74782M in one of our products, there are some others
> in the same family, don't know about availability though.

Nice chip. Seems that is would do what I want, but looks like unobtainium
in small quantities. Who sells Sanyo in the USA. NOT Sanyo...
Sanyo's semi site doesn't even list it. Had to find data on datasheets.com.

Yes, I have thought of using a PIC to do OSD, although the resolution
of the characters would be limited by memory and clock speed.
The fussy part is getting a good clock lock on something that has high
jitter, like tape playback without TBC. The purpose built chips do it
well. I'd rather not have to reinvent the PLL wheel. A 'knock off' chip
would be great, but who is going to do that any time soon?

Robert


2006\05\15@144941 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
I got a spec, this LC74782M looks pretty good, Dave. But the device is
NOT on
their active list, alas.

--Bob

Dave Wheeler wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2006\05\15@171525 by Peter

picon face


On Sun, 14 May 2006, Robert Rolf wrote:
>
>> If you mean PIP, Philips makes something I think.
>
> No, I am looking for OSD (on screen display of text).
> Seems the only stuff in production is meant for RGB CRT & LCD screens.
> Nothing out there to do composite video (monochrome).
> BOB III is nice but I'd like to know what chip he's using.

Try Fujitsu, NJRC and NEC.

Peter

2006\05\18@170621 by Robert Rolf

picon face
Peter wrote:
>
> On Sun, 14 May 2006, Robert Rolf wrote:
>
>>>If you mean PIP, Philips makes something I think.
>>
>>No, I am looking for OSD (on screen display of text).
>>Seems the only stuff in production is meant for RGB CRT & LCD screens.
>>Nothing out there to do composite video (monochrome).
>>BOB III is nice but I'd like to know what chip he's using.
>
>
> Try Fujitsu, NJRC and NEC.

Thanks, but try get get small volumes of parts from the above.
NEC has a nice device, as does Sanyo, but it's unobtainium
unless I want 5000 pieces, which I do not.

Guess I'm going to have to do it with a big fast PIC and live
with the lower resolution and no color.

Robert


'[EE] Video overlay chips (OSD text)'
2006\08\18@141231 by M. Adam Davis
face picon face
On 5/14/06, Robert Rolf <.....Robert.RolfKILLspamspam@spam@ualberta.ca> wrote:
> BOB III is nice but I'd like to know what chip he's using.

On the Bob-4 page he states:
"BOB-3 customers should transition to BOB-4 without delay. BOB-3
shipments beyond September of 2006 cannot be guaranteed. Note that
changes to module pinout have occurred, relative to BOB-3. Download
the current BOB-4 Application Guide (see below) for full details."

So it appears that whatever chip he's using for bob-3 is now going EOL
as well.  The Bob-4 is the same price, though, and adds bitmap
graphics, vector drawing, proportional fonts, etc.

Looks like an FPGA, microcontroller, and memory.

-Adam

2006\08\19@075031 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
M. Adam Davis wrote:
> On 5/14/06, Robert Rolf <Robert.RolfspamKILLspamualberta.ca> wrote:
>  
>> BOB III is nice but I'd like to know what chip he's using.
>>    
>
> On the Bob-4 page he states:
> "BOB-3 customers should transition to BOB-4 without delay. BOB-3
> shipments beyond September of 2006 cannot be guaranteed. Note that
> changes to module pinout have occurred, relative to BOB-3. Download
> the current BOB-4 Application Guide (see below) for full details."
>
> So it appears that whatever chip he's using for bob-3 is now going EOL
> as well.  The Bob-4 is the same price, though, and adds bitmap
> graphics, vector drawing, proportional fonts, etc.
>
> Looks like an FPGA, microcontroller, and memory.
>
> -Adam
>  
It'll be pricey (the FPGA) but it looks like the BOB4 is a fix.

I knew his BOB3 Mitsubitsi (sp?) character generator was going tits up, too.

--Bob

2006\08\21@100321 by M. Adam Davis

face picon face
He's listing it at the same price ($99) as the BOB3.  You can use a
pretty small/cheap FPGA that simply becomes a memory-->video
converter.  The  microcontroller simply waits for vertical sync to
update the memory, and you can do all the graphics and text functions
in the micro.

Maybe use a little bigger fpga and put in dual access to the RAM
(since the video generator only reads there should never be a
conflict).

Of course, I'd like to see the BOB4 down in the $20 area, it's just a
video controller.

-Adam

On 8/19/06, Bob Axtell <.....engineerKILLspamspam.....neomailbox.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -


'[EE] Video overlay chips (OSD text)'
2008\01\04@220722 by Zik Saleeba
face picon face
Digging up this old thread from 2006...

I've been keeping my eyes out for OSD chips for quite some time now.
It seems that there is a new alternative to the ST5730A.

"The MAX7456 single-channel monochrome on-screen display (OSD)
generator lowers system cost by eliminating the need for an external
video driver, sync separator, video switch, and EEPROM. The MAX7456
serves all national and international markets with 256
user-programmable characters in NTSC and PAL standards. The MAX7456
easily displays information such as company logo, custom graphics,
time, and date with arbitrary characters and sizes. The MAX7456 is
preloaded with 256 characters and pictographs and can be reprogrammed
in-circuit using the SPI™ port.

"The MAX7456 is available in a 28-pin TSSOP package and is fully
specified over the extended (-40°C to +85°C) temperature range."

http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/5516

Yes, it's Maxim. But at least you can buy it from digikey for $12 in
2500+ quantity.

Cheers,
Zik

2008\01\05@011012 by David P Harris

picon face
They even have a eval kit for $100 which basically gives you a
freestanding unit!

David

Zik Saleeba wrote:
{Quote hidden}

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